PGIIID - Kampagnenmodus - Prestige Cap | Jensencap

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PGIIID - Kampagnenmodus - Prestige Cap | Jensencap

Beitrag von Darth Vader » So 3. Aug 2014, 22:31

Hi to all,

Talking with one very good and experienced player I have found that he didn’t know about PRESTIGE CAP. It could be that there are more people who don’t know about it or don’t consider how important prestige cap is for playing campaigns. I am not sure if this subject was already discussed in PL forum, if not, I hope that this post can be useful for some players.

The thing is a little bit complicated, so I will try just to present basic principles.

In general we are earning prestige from two sources. One is occupying the cities, and that is directly related to settings we put, and the other is from prestige cap (prestige that we get at the end of scenario) and it is same for any setting. Normally that is applied for all campaigns, and Guderians Strategis will be taken as an example.
For Madrid prestige cap is 2000, Chicenow 2500, Souslami 3000 etc. The amount that we will get after finishing scenario is actually a Prestige Cap value decreased by the value of purchased units and the prestige we have on our account. Our core army (units that are given at the beginning of campaign) and prototype units are not included in a prestige cap, and that is the most important thing.
That means, after Madrid, if we purchase new units for 2000, which include units that we have bought during the battle, we will receive only 500 when we finish Chicenow. So, if I initially have 2000 prestige but I spend 700 prestige for upgrade and overstrenght of our core units, then I can buy new units for only 1300 prestige, when I finish Chicenow I will receive 1200 prestige (2500-1300).
That is a very simplified example. In fact it’s a little bit more complicated, but I am trying not be too confusing.

We can discuss whether it is better to have bigger army, or smaller but more modern one . There are arguments for bought sides. Personally I prefer the more modern one and I will present some benefits of efficiently using prestige cap. I have tested in practice that Guderian Strategies can be played successfully with settings of only 50 for Germans in all scenarios (Dunkirk is little bit tough, but anyhow it is very hard, and Windsor 1940 can be avoided) even against best players. Regardless of settings, if we upgrade our core army to maximum in first three or four scenarios, in fact we will have more expensive army (because we had gotten more prestige and invested it in upgrades) and more efficient army comparing to the armies where new units are purchased for all prestige. There is also a downside of this strategy. If we lose 2 or more core units in first 3 scenarios it is much harder to recover. So I am very careful and slow in first 3 scenarios, and often I am losing them (scenarios), but as long as I have BV and all core units alive the job is done. From Sedan onward only the best armies can keep the speed of my “upgraded army”, not because of my tactics on battlefield but due to the quality of the army.
At the end of this long post I will just give two tips for players who don’t want to bother with math and waste too much time in studding theory of prestige cap, and some links where all the things are explained in details for the ones who are interested.
At the end of each scenario just do upgrade or overstrenght core and prototype units for at least 500 prestige until you come to Dunkirk.
As long as you are under prestige cap you can refit for 200-300 during the scenario, that will come at no cost at all.
These are the tree pages of the same site where prestige cap is explained. There are more sites, but in my opinion this is the best explanation. The site is in English and they call prestige cap “Jensen” cap.
It would be great if somebody knew links with explanations in German, so everybody could understand.

http://whoopy-cat.com/panzers/pg2/pg2-05-2.htm
http://whoopy-cat.com/panzers/pg2/pg2-05-3.htm
http://whoopy-cat.com/panzers/pg2/pg2-05-4.htm


MAY THE FORCE BE WITH YOU

Darth
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08 15
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Re: PGIIID - Kampagnenmodus - Prestige Cap | Jensencap

Beitrag von 08 15 » Mo 4. Aug 2014, 22:20

Hi Darth,

this was quite a usefull post. :daumen:

In fact, I didn`t had a clue :angst: what this capacity thing was about, even if I wondered about it in the past.

So today, I also had a look at these pages you mentioned and things turned out to become more clear.

It`s the totally opposite of my habbits to play campaigns usually.
I normaly avoid spending PP on healing or overstrengthening my Units.
I`m selling Prototypes and rather buy new, more usefull ones... :D

But, by this new Point of View, it is maybe more clever to keep the free Core- and Prototype- Units and build `em up, while still collecting tons of PP. :)
An then, as you wrote, lateron expanding the core...

Even if I don`t play PG 3D Campaigns too often anymore, I`m gonna check it with an OG- Campaign - maybe tonight - and see if it works there too. I´ve noticed that in the AAR`s of OG the capacity cap is shown too.

For sure I let everyone know through a post - whenever I know, if it works.

see u

08 15
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Re: PGIIID - Kampagnenmodus - Prestige Cap | Jensencap

Beitrag von Parabellum » Di 5. Aug 2014, 08:19

Erstaunlich. Da hat doch tatsächlich jemand die guten alten Seiten von whoopy-cat gefunden.
Die Vorstellung des Jensencap sollte aber in einem eigenen Thread erfolgen. Hier mitten im Ergebnisdienst findet das später kein Mensch mehr wieder :aua: .

Ich erlaube mir auf die Fachkompetenz des Raiders-Forum hinzuweisen. Bereits 2010 und 2012 wurde dieses Thema von Altmeister Hoza :old1: , Rayydar und anderen im Zusammenhang mit dem Kampagnenbau zur Sprache gebracht. Die Beiträge sind etwas verstreut. Deshalb habe ich hier mal die Suchergebnisse verlinkt: http://306611.homepagemodules.de/search ... derby=date

Meiner Kenntnis nach gibt es keine deutsche Übersetzung. Wenn sich da mal ein fähiger Übersetzer ranmachen würde wäre das :sensa: !

VG von P aus C
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Re: PGIIID - Kampagnenmodus - Prestige Cap | Jensencap

Beitrag von RamsesII » Di 5. Aug 2014, 13:56

Hallo Leute, hey folks,

sehr guter Beitrag - ich habe dafür einen extra Thread eröffnet.

Very goog thread, I just opened a new one for better visibility.


Viele Grüße & best regards
Volker

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Darth Vader
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Re: PGIIID - Kampagnenmodus - Prestige Cap | Jensencap

Beitrag von Darth Vader » Mi 6. Aug 2014, 01:34

Hi to all,

my apologies for putting the post in the wrong thread. Topic was about campaigns and I thought that was the write place to post it.

Thank you Volker for correcting the thread.

Hi 08 15 ,
I am very happy that you like the post.
Tell us how it works in OG, and do you find it easier or harder to play below the cap.

Best regards,
Darth (Srdja)
If your advance is going well, you are walking into an ambush.

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Re: PGIIID - Kampagnenmodus - Prestige Cap | Jensencap

Beitrag von 08 15 » Mo 1. Sep 2014, 19:18

Hi everybody,

so as I said, I`ve played (started) some OG Campaigns trying to stay below the Cap.
Things work, as Darth said, also in OG Campaigns - you get some extra PP. :)
Nice Thing about it is, that you can see the Prestige Capacity whenever checking the AAR.

But, I didn`t do too good - so after a while i switched back to my normal habbits of just buying Troops without taking care about the Cap...
Probably it is best when you play Campaigns with a whole bunch of core Units...
So I wanted to play "Guderians Strategy" in PG3D to try things out there.
But how do I know which the capacity is? :gaga:

see u

0815
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Re: PGIIID - Kampagnenmodus - Prestige Cap | Jensencap

Beitrag von Darth Vader » Fr 5. Sep 2014, 23:09

HI 08 15,

after first scenario (Madrid) limit is 2000. After that, in each scenario prestige cap is increased for 500. That means if you are for example 700 below cap, and each time after scenario you buy, or overstrenght non core units for only 500 you will remain 700 below the cap. Don't forget to refit damaged units that can enter the battle again. At least you have margin of 200-300 hundreds for refit that will come for free (depending of scenario, more cities to occupy bigger the margin) and units will pick up more experience and have more chances for decoration.

:w62: :w62:


MAY THE FORCE BE WITH YOU

Darth
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Re: PGIIID - Kampagnenmodus - Prestige Cap | Jensencap

Beitrag von Darth Vader » Mo 2. Mai 2016, 00:02

Hello Gentlemen,

I would like to make one experiment. Is anybody interested to play one asymmetric campaign with me? Guderian strategies, as that is the only campaign that I know to play.
What I men by asymmetric. I will always play at 50% for German setting and defender setting should be as recommended. My opponent will play as recommended or higher setting for Germans. For my experiment it is important just to report after each scenario how many prestige did you gain and what troops did you purchased/sold during scenario. Off course I will report the same from my side. I will make statistics how much prestige I have gain during the campaign, and how much mu opponent. We can also before the last scenario sell all the troops, to see the total value of the army, in prestige. I am almost sure that I will get more prestige during the campaign, but the value of the army will be smaller (only in prestige :D ).
Just to make clear that my potential opponent will not have any advantage because of different prestige settings. For my way of playing, after first three scenarios, it's absolutely the same if I play with 50% or 100%. We will report games regularly for campaign competition.

The gauntlet has been thrown! :tiger:

Best regards,
Darth (Srdja)
If your advance is going well, you are walking into an ambush.

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